No woman who’s truly in search of the real thing, bases her desicion on the wallet factor. I respect your opinion, since I strongly believe relationships are a two way street.

But as I have suggested before: the stage of dating is a must, since you don’t jump right into the “going steady phase”, if you will. And during the first dates, u don’t discuss all of those notions you have so articulatly described in your respone. You try to get to know the person within the time & place limits, before you go & dig deeper & deeper, which is something to do in the more advances stages.
You are not gonna want to dig deeper, if a woman shows up in her sweats. Her stating to you, that she’s usually very fashion oriented, won’t cut it. Why? ‘casue you don’t know her yet!

Again, first impressions. If all of us could fall inlove at first site, you guys would NEVER have to open your wallets & as for us gals? well, we could date in our jammis, wearing green/blue facial masks with curlers in our hair.

Forgive me, but I have never described myself as assertive. You may have gotten that notion from my talkbacks, but I’m not. I speak my mind, am independent, but am not assertive or tough, though I feel that with Israeli men, maybe it’s time I should.

I have no idea how old you are, but a lot of the Isaeli men in their 30′s I come across with, don’t think they ough a woman anything. They do however expect women to be very self sufficient, whilst this character exactley, is what gives them the excuse to back out, since at the same time, they would like the little wife type of woman.

Conclusion: there is always an excuse, when you are scared to grow up. And trust me: I know a lot of assertive women or “klaftas” if you will, who are happily married.

Thank you for your kind and insightful response! It’s refreshing to see that some women are understanding of the difficulties men have to endure when trying to meet a woman.

You’re right, there are cultural divides. There are men out there who don’t want a woman to usurp their traditional masculine role. But really, do you want to be with a guy who doesn’t want you to surpass his success? Do you want to be with a man who limits your progress in such a way that it does not exceed his? If I’m with a woman, I’ll support her and contribute to every aspect of her success, even if it means that it surpasses my own.

A man who is intimidated by the success of the woman in his life is not a man… he’s a boy, and needs to grow up.

Good luck on your search! I hope you find a guy that appreciates you for who you are, and everything you bring to a relationship!

M.J.

I’m afraid my dear that it is you who still does not get it.

Yes, men are visual. Guess what… women are visual too! Don’t pretend for a second that you don’t care how a guy looks… women are just as much into physical appearance as men. To imply otherwise is ludicrous.

Yes, we understand that women put a lot of effort into their physical appearance. Really, we do. We men know it’s a lot of work for women, and we respect and appreciate every second it takes.

Now, do you understand how much effort we men put into looking good? Do you understand that we have much FEWER options available to us to try to make ourselves appear more presentable to a lady? If we have bad skin, we can’t cover it up with any kind of makeup. There is no accentuating anything with mascara or lipstick. Our wardrobe options are minute compared to what women have available to them, and god help us if we’re overweight ’cause no suit is going to cover that up! To compensate for this, the best we can do is try to take care of ourselves physically, do what we can with our hair (or for some guys, what’s left of it), and if we’re lucky, we can purchase clothing that compliments us without the need to miss a mortgage payment…

…and, we have to do all this without actually looking like we’re trying. There’s nothing more pathetic then a guy who spends sooo much time and money trying to look good, because god help us if we come off effiminate! That’s right, on top of it all, we have to try and hide it.

You need to realize that it’s not a competition. All that we ask is the recognition that women are not the only ones who are haunted by their physical appearance, and are not the only ones who go to rediculous lenghts to make themselves look good. For many men, this has become an obsession.

Frankly, I find it troubling when a woman takes this kind of attitude. You need to understand that most men out there (at least the genuine, kind, & serious & ones who are looking for something real) avoid a woman who subscribes to these theories.

Please, for your own sake, trust me on this.

M.J.

Once again, I respect what you have to say and understand the perspective from which you are speaking, but I don’t think you’re looking at it through a man’s eyes.

For the most part, we have no problem treating a lady on the first date, or any subsequent meeting, as long as we feel that we are equal participants. What this means is that, while we are more than happy to put forth such meaningful gestures, we draw the line at having to prove ourselves solely with those gestures.

I can’t speak for all men, but I can say that when a woman offers to carry a bit of the weight (financially or otherwise) in a relationship (or on a date), it tells me that she is a modern woman who is interested in contributing, equally, in the same ways as any man. It tells me that she’s not going to get brainwashed into thinking that her role as a woman restricts her ability to take care of the man in her life. It tells me that there’s thought to her action; that she’s not marching to someone else’s beat, but setting her own and doing things her way, because she has the capacity to think and do whatever she wants. I want to know that if I meet a woman, she’s not doing something or following some convention because that’s what is expected of her… but rather, because it’s what she expects of herself.

I’m sure I don’t need to point out the obvious, but you should be weary of the “good first impression”, because it’s too easy a thing to fake. I don’t want to meet a woman who needs me to impress her with little things like paying a bill, or picking her up. I see those acts as shallow, superficial, and too easy to fake. Any slimebag can buy you a drink… but the true test is how he treats you when you had just a bit too many of them.

Really, we just don’t want to feel used. Like it’s our JOB to show the lady a good time. Dating in and of itself can be a very stressful experience for a guy.

You’re right – men do look for true ladies. And I believe that a true lady wants to be with a man who respects himself… and any self-respecting guy isn’t going to try to win a girl over with the contents of his wallet.

M.J.

Your posts were enlightening, articulate and interesting – and I was happy to hear the male side of this topic. I am a single American woman living in Israel, and find that the mentality here is very different from the States, which is why, while I don’t agree with Rosina’s point of view, I understand it – her behavior is actually attractive to the majority of Israeli males (forgive me the generalization – I’m sure there are exeptions…). Assertive, successful and/or intelligent women tend to intimidate them here. Perhaps that’s why Sharon (who claims she is assertive) feels that men won’t take relationships with her to the next level. I think we can all agree that finding a mate is quite complicated, and there are no hard fast rules that apply to everyone.
Thanks for sharing!
– Elianna

You will.

Y’all just don’t understand how much time and money women have to spend to look good. Women (still) make less money than men for the same job in many careers. Women’s clothes are more expensive (on average). Women’s hair cuts are more expensive (on average). Women are taken advantage of in this way b/c clothing designers and hairstylists know women will pay. B/c men are visual.

The man should pay. And if the man doesn’t pay or doesn’t realize he should pay – that’s okay too. B/c you know what? Unless you are attracted to the woman who wears sweats, her hair in an elastic, and no makeup you will pay. Maybe not on most dates…maybe not during your “courtship”….but believe me, once you get married – the bills will come in and you will finally realize how expensive it is being a woman.

A very wise Rabbi once said “You never really know a woman until you marry her”. Trust me on this

My best friend is engaged to european, but he is actually a native Israeli & and she managed to persuade him to live in Israel half the time. If I come across a nice Tzabara (hebrew term for a native Israeli girl), I’ll be sure to inform you.